Quantcast

HTGAWM| Episode 6 X 13 "What If Sam Wasn’t the Bad Guy This Whole Time?" 4/30

GotSomethingToSay

Team Owner
Joined
Jul 14, 2018
Messages
19,293
Reaction score
Reactions
133,693 9,034 5,302
136,471
Alleybux
42,500
Wowwww just finished the episode and I’m floored. This show has had me on the ropes for years and it doesn’t end.

I would have NEVER guessed why Sam kept Frank around even after the baby died and now it’s all making sense.
Does Sam know that's his child? Maybe he was told to look out for Frank for a different reason...
 

NIA HANABI

Quote me (fka Peachez)
Joined
Jun 21, 2015
Messages
4,369
Reaction score
Reactions
26,625 227 25
34,960
Alleybux
61,551
I just watched the episode and the they’re trying to say that Frank is Hannah and Sam’s child? So two SIBLINGS had an incest child with NO physical disfigurements or disabilities?

The writers are just pulling sh!t out of their asses.
 

Angela Davis

General Manager
OLDHEAD
Joined
Aug 27, 2005
Messages
3,360
Reaction score
Reactions
41,214 520 66
46,754
Alleybux
501
I just watched the episode and the they’re trying to say that Frank is Hannah and Sam’s child? So two SIBLINGS had an incest child with NO physical disfigurements or disabilities?

The writers are just pulling sh!t out of their asses.
Frank is really fµcked up in the head. He's a killer who enjoys killing, but has a heart of gold when it comes to people he loves. I guess their logic is Frank's disability is psychological?

I hate that the viewers have to find ways to explain this sh!tty writing. I'm ready for this to be over which is sad because this show started off with such promise only for them to ruin it. I thought this show was going to focus on Annalise's legal expertise. I miss them working on actual cases; the students competing for Annalise's approval while she showed them how it's really done. I don't understand why this show became what it is right now.
 

Wynter Noel

I’m going to groan your ass back with vengeance
Benched
Time Out
Joined
Jan 4, 2019
Messages
12,499
Reaction score
Reactions
64,264 2,651 1,620
63,867
Alleybux
80,962
Annalise shouldn’t even be upset, I mean, it’s clear she prefers women. Sam was just her beard anyway.

That’s what I was thinking too. I was confused, she only got with him to stop her feelings for eve, so why so pressed about Sam? I guess it’s more of an ego stroke than anything.
 

David Alleyne

Starter
Joined
Mar 3, 2018
Messages
179
Reaction score
Reactions
1,106 128 103
1,035
Alleybux
37,694
Do you honestly think that's why?
I was trying not to go there but I thought of that.

Oh, definitely. I think the level of sympathy and leeway (or lack thereof in Nate's case) accorded to Frank and Nate would be dramatically different if both characters were black or if both characters were white.
 

back2life

General Manager
Joined
May 18, 2012
Messages
1,833
Reaction score
Reactions
6,659 40 21
6,985
Alleybux
2,615
Oh, definitely. I think the level of sympathy and leeway (or lack thereof in Nate's case) accorded to Frank and Nate would be dramatically different if both characters were black or if both characters were white.

I agree. In my opinion Frank is just as much of a villian as others.
 

GrahamCracker

Don't fµck with me fellas!
Joined
Oct 4, 2017
Messages
9,975
Reaction score
Reactions
109,120 709 177
141,951
Alleybux
0
He wanted to tell Analise but Sam told him not to.
My problem with Frank is that on top of that he did nothing about the Lila murder aftermath. Now it's beyond obvious the writers came up with that twist late in the season but for me that made him beyond redemption when he was being given the over the top redemption arc in S3.
It made the show too subjective and "dumb" in a way in the sense that i get that the writing can get a bit creative and push the boundaries of common sense, but i can't really take anything reasoning about characters being redeemable or not seriously. It's not what they're guilty of, their motives or whatever else one could get from the writing - it's about who is Pete's "fave" and who isn't.
 

back2life

General Manager
Joined
May 18, 2012
Messages
1,833
Reaction score
Reactions
6,659 40 21
6,985
Alleybux
2,615
My problem with Frank is that on top of that he did nothing about the Lila murder aftermath. Now it's beyond obvious the writers came up with that twist late in the season but for me that made him beyond redemption when he was being given the over the top redemption arc in S3.
It made the show too subjective and "dumb" in a way in the sense that i get that the writing can get a bit creative and push the boundaries of common sense, but i can't really take anything reasoning about characters being redeemable or not seriously. It's not what they're guilty of, their motives or whatever else one could get from the writing - it's about who is Pete's "fave" and who isn't.

You think so? I've heard about writers having their faves but wasn't sure if it was true
Even taking in people's responses I find it annoying that Frank's character is written as a "redeemable", "ride or die" while Nate is written as some "bitter" man who blames Annalise for everything.
 

SadSadSong

Team Owner
Joined
Sep 29, 2012
Messages
23,936
Reaction score
Reactions
145,023 4,981 3,648
167,125
Alleybux
93,291
This show jumped the shark with this episode. What the fµck was this bµllsh!t! Incest, Incest babies? Girl fµck Pete! If this show wasn't about to end I would quit now.
 

SadSadSong

Team Owner
Joined
Sep 29, 2012
Messages
23,936
Reaction score
Reactions
145,023 4,981 3,648
167,125
Alleybux
93,291
True. I remember reading on here a while ago about how the boyfriend of some actress (Tilda Swinton) is the product of incest. His parents are daughter and father, and he looks normal.

nintchdbpict000302294697.jpg


I'm sure he also doesn't have any major disabilities if he's even able to talk about this.


I'm going to hell because I initially glanced over your post and read it as Tilda Swinton is the product of incest and I was like she looks it, but after re-reading your post in full..... :unsure:
 

Iron_Dolly

Team Owner
Joined
Aug 11, 2015
Messages
7,845
Reaction score
Reactions
52,649 1,071 557
55,446
Alleybux
140,942
It's been long since I've viewed a HTGAWM thread, so I'm unaware of people's opinion in here but am I the only ones who gets annoyed by how Frank's character is viewed vs how Nate's is?

They've all done stuff but for some reason people act like Nate is such a villian and Frank is some hero despite him not hesitating to hurt or threaten ANYONE.

Frank is absolutely a villain. The difference is he’s a smart bad guy. He kills and has a plan to dispose of a body and does things in a controlled manner.

Nate beats a man to near death with his bare hands and can only sit and shake talking about, he killed my pops he killed my pops. Kills another man with his bare hands and leaves him there to rot, likely ending up in’s Annalise suffering for his foolish uncontrollable actions
.

They are both villains. Frank is definitely more cold and being a killer is second nature to him at this point. Now that we know his real parents are brother and sister no wonder he's so fµcked up in the head. The problem with Nate is that he is not level-headed and he is sloppy, leaving other people to literally clean up his mess. He claims to hate Annalise but keeps coming back, he helps her, then turns his back on her. He worked with the feds against Annalise and acts like his hands are clean. He finds out who was responsible for having his dad killed, yet he is still trying to help put Anna away. Frank has been as loyal to Anna as she has allowed him to be, he doesn't act without thinking, he's not messy, and he takes accountability.
 

GrahamCracker

Don't fµck with me fellas!
Joined
Oct 4, 2017
Messages
9,975
Reaction score
Reactions
109,120 709 177
141,951
Alleybux
0
They are both villains. Frank is definitely more cold and being a killer is second nature to him at this point. Now that we know his real parents are brother and sister no wonder he's so fµcked up in the head. The problem with Nate is that he is not level-headed and he is sloppy, leaving other people to literally clean up his mess. He claims to hate Annalise but keeps coming back, he helps her, then turns his back on her. He worked with the feds against Annalise and acts like his hands are clean. He finds out who was responsible for having his dad killed, yet he is still trying to help put Anna away. Frank has been as loyal to Anna as she has allowed him to be, he doesn't act without thinking, he's not messy, and he takes accountability.
How? He was responsible for the whole Lila mess and did a big nothing to clean that up. His killing of Dominick was identical to Nate killing Xavier circumstances and context included. He's faithful to Annalise because without Laurel to droll over around the writers can't find him anything else to do.
 

atx

General Manager
Joined
Nov 2, 2016
Messages
1,314
Reaction score
Reactions
13,645 426 45
16,906
Alleybux
88,329
Because Pete Nowalk, the creator and writer, has lost his damn mind. He got away in the first season with writing as he went along, but over six years; you have to have a plot a in mind with development and an end goal and write ahead of time instead of looking to twitter for where you should go.

thanks!! So Sam and his sister had a baby which is Frank. Why are they bringing this up now?
 

GrahamCracker

Don't fµck with me fellas!
Joined
Oct 4, 2017
Messages
9,975
Reaction score
Reactions
109,120 709 177
141,951
Alleybux
0
Because Pete Nowalk, the creator and writer, has lost his damn mind. He got away in the first season with writing as he went along, but over six years; you have to have a plot a in mind with development and an end goal and write ahead of time instead of looking to twitter for where you should go.
Or worse - reddit.
 

GrahamCracker

Don't fµck with me fellas!
Joined
Oct 4, 2017
Messages
9,975
Reaction score
Reactions
109,120 709 177
141,951
Alleybux
0
You think so? I've heard about writers having their faves but wasn't sure if it was true
Even taking in people's responses I find it annoying that Frank's character is written as a "redeemable", "ride or die" while Nate is written as some "bitter" man who blames Annalise for everything.
What Wes, Nate and Gabe have in common? The viewers want them dead and Pete hate-writes them.

The writers always indulged in double standards. I mean everyone got on the K5 because affirmative action except Connor who got in on merit while spending the whole first season being a dumb ho?
 

Iron_Dolly

Team Owner
Joined
Aug 11, 2015
Messages
7,845
Reaction score
Reactions
52,649 1,071 557
55,446
Alleybux
140,942
How? He was responsible for the whole Lila mess and did a big nothing to clean that up. His killing of Dominick was identical to Nate killing Xavier circumstances and context included. He's faithful to Annalise because without Laurel to droll over around the writers can't find him anything else to do.

Sam ordered the hit on Lila. There wasn't anything to clean up except for that wallpaper pic but he couldn't get in her phone. With the body being in the water tank on top of her sorority house, it sent detectives to point the finger at Rebecca and her bf for a while. Frank definitely was emotional about Laurel when he killed Dominick but he killed Wes and was responsible for Laurel almost dying. Dominick also was snooping around Gabriel, he was going to be next. Still we never heard anything else about Dominick.
 

back2life

General Manager
Joined
May 18, 2012
Messages
1,833
Reaction score
Reactions
6,659 40 21
6,985
Alleybux
2,615
What Wes, Nate and Gabe have in common? The viewers want them dead and Pete hate-writes them.

The writers always indulged in double standards. I mean everyone got on the K5 because affirmative action except Connor who got in on merit while spending the whole first season being a dumb ho?

Don't forget Laurel. I'm almost stopped watching after the season that they made into her sob story after Wes supposedly "died".

They tried so hard to make it seem like she was "in love" with Wes & like she was the only one who ever cared for him. That season was more about her sob story than it was about Annalise.

I don't miss her character at all.
 

HelloKitty811

You’re the facsimile, I’m the original.
Joined
Jul 19, 2018
Messages
9,767
Reaction score
Reactions
55,028 961 40
63,864
Alleybux
558,520
So can we say that these two are two different sides of the same coin then?
They are both villains. Frank is definitely more cold and being a killer is second nature to him at this point. Now that we know his real parents are brother and sister no wonder he's so fµcked up in the head. The problem with Nate is that he is not level-headed and he is sloppy, leaving other people to literally clean up his mess. He claims to hate Annalise but keeps coming back, he helps her, then turns his back on her. He worked with the feds against Annalise and acts like his hands are clean. He finds out who was responsible for having his dad killed, yet he is still trying to help put Anna away. Frank has been as loyal to Anna as she has allowed him to be, he doesn't act without thinking, he's not messy, and he takes accountability.
 

HelloKitty811

You’re the facsimile, I’m the original.
Joined
Jul 19, 2018
Messages
9,767
Reaction score
Reactions
55,028 961 40
63,864
Alleybux
558,520
Because Pete Nowalk, the creator and writer, has lost his damn mind. He got away in the first season with writing as he went along, but over six years; you have to have a plot a in mind with development and an end goal and write ahead of time instead of looking to twitter for where you should go.
THIS! Pete has admitted more than once that he did not plan much of anything and writes off the cuff without regarding how his unthoughtful, ill-conceived writing will affect the series arc as a whole. Who writes like this? Which film school did this man attend? This seems to be unorthodox and highly nonsensical. Going to message boards, Twitter and reddit for ideas? GTFOH:ROFLMAO:
 

rhjunkie

Team Owner
Joined
Apr 27, 2019
Messages
13,493
Reaction score
Reactions
113,125 865 625
121,551
Alleybux
1,221,286
I just watched the episode and the they’re trying to say that Frank is Hannah and Sam’s child? So two SIBLINGS had an incest child with NO physical disfigurements or disabilities?

The writers are just pulling sh!t out of their asses.

The same thing crossed my mind as well so I googled it to see if there were statistics available - the numbers I saw were lower than I thought they'd be but still pretty high (around 50%). I guess they wanted a reason to explain Frank's psychology but this seems like the writers pulling sh!t out of their ass for the sake of shock value because they have really dropped the ball on building a cohesive storyline.
 

NIA HANABI

Quote me (fka Peachez)
Joined
Jun 21, 2015
Messages
4,369
Reaction score
Reactions
26,625 227 25
34,960
Alleybux
61,551
Frank is really fµcked up in the head. He's a killer who enjoys killing, but has a heart of gold when it comes to people he loves. I guess their logic is Frank's disability is psychological?

I hate that the viewers have to find ways to explain this sh!tty writing. I'm ready for this to be over which is sad because this show started off with such promise only for them to ruin it. I thought this show was going to focus on Annalise's legal expertise. I miss them working on actual cases; the students competing for Annalise's approval while she showed them how it's really done. I don't understand why this show became what it is right now.

I’m sure the writers think that Frank being mentally/psychologically screwed up completely explains away the fact that he is fully able-bodied despite being the product of a brother and sister. I get that they want to wrap this up all while still throwing in a few twist at the end, but they need to make sense. Viewers aren’t stupid, brothers and sisters share way too much of the same DNA.
 

GrahamCracker

Don't fµck with me fellas!
Joined
Oct 4, 2017
Messages
9,975
Reaction score
Reactions
109,120 709 177
141,951
Alleybux
0
Sam ordered the hit on Lila. There wasn't anything to clean up except for that wallpaper pic but he couldn't get in her phone. With the body being in the water tank on top of her sorority house, it sent detectives to point the finger at Rebecca and her bf for a while. Frank definitely was emotional about Laurel when he killed Dominick but he killed Wes and was responsible for Laurel almost dying. Dominick also was snooping around Gabriel, he was going to be next. Still we never heard anything else about Dominick.
giphy.gif


We ain't gonna hear nothing about Xavier either. Annalise was pissed at Frank for killing Dominick because she wanted information from him.

The aftermath to Lila's murder was a whole mess on a number of sides all stemming from the ambiguity surrounding who actually killed her - Frank could have put a stop on that at any point but chose not to. The whole mess in S1 originates from something Frank did and than stood by as it was unraveling. He is the only character who could have stopped that mess at any given time but did absolutely nothing about it. There really is no way of explaining that away except for the writing being very forgiving with him.

HTGAWM isn't really consistent with this stuff, the character dependent double standards are way too heavy handed. It's all about what a character is afforded rather than what they did, their motivations and what they deserve.
 

Imani1

.
Joined
Apr 9, 2017
Messages
649
Reaction score
Reactions
14,035 242 36
15,663
Alleybux
19,652
- Man..I saw people talking about a twist and got excited, only to be met with Hannah and Sam. Who asked for this??
- Why are they wasting time like this isn't the last season?
- Why didn't they use Sam's unnecessary screentime during the last few season to tie up loose ends?
- Why are they trying to redeem this man. No one gives a damn about Sam, but somehow it's always about that man.
- They could've kept this episode. It was basically a filler episode with a twist at the end to fool us.
 

GrahamCracker

Don't fµck with me fellas!
Joined
Oct 4, 2017
Messages
9,975
Reaction score
Reactions
109,120 709 177
141,951
Alleybux
0
Don't forget Laurel. I'm almost stopped watching after the season that they made into her sob story after Wes supposedly "died".

They tried so hard to make it seem like she was "in love" with Wes & like she was the only one who ever cared for him. That season was more about her sob story than it was about Annalise.

I don't miss her character at all.
It's because Wes' death was forced so was the relationship with Laurel which was consequentially rushed. Them being together could have been interesting in terms of power dynamics - it would have rendered Connor miserable as he would have been perpetually outnumbered by Annalise and Wes and the people loyal to them.
 

Romey

CIS!!!!
Joined
May 6, 2011
Messages
25,443
Reaction score
Reactions
71,698 6,323 5,636
70,080
Alleybux
350,866
I honestly need to rewatch this show from the beginning. Theres been so much thats happened that I cant even rememeber
 

Gysti

The world is cruel; therefore I won't be
Joined
Feb 4, 2018
Messages
1,700
Reaction score
Reactions
14,062 185 20
15,209
Alleybux
14,000
In the flashback why was Frank trying to call Hannah? Were they close??
I don't even wanna type what I'm thinking rn
 

Sp0ttie0ttie

DopalisciousAngel
Joined
Jun 19, 2008
Messages
13,475
Reaction score
Reactions
70,770 1,239 687
74,983
Alleybux
97,178
I honestly need to rewatch this show from the beginning. Theres been so much thats happened that I cant even rememeber
That’s what I did and it has helped. When Vivian told Annalise about Sam and Hannah I immediately thought about the joke she made in season 1.
 

nozeygirl

Team Owner
Joined
Nov 6, 2018
Messages
6,987
Reaction score
Reactions
74,052 1,444 45
79,286
Alleybux
266,000
I was very disappointed in Thursday’s episode!! Are there 2 more episodes to go? When are we going to see Wes? I need Anna Mae to come out on top!
 

nozeygirl

Team Owner
Joined
Nov 6, 2018
Messages
6,987
Reaction score
Reactions
74,052 1,444 45
79,286
Alleybux
266,000
Anyone got the preview for next week? My dvr was being an ass and didn’t work.
 

Similar Threads

News Alley

Ask LSA

The Lounge

General Alley

Top Bottom