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Kongo influence in the Americas

Marvolo

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A thread to talk about the influence of the Kongo people in the Americas.

Haiti
It's estimated that about half of the slaves brought to Saint-Domingue came from the Kongo kingdom. After the Fon slaves from Benin, they imput the largest influence on Haitian Creole and Haitian Vodou (for example Paquet congo and Kongo loa)

A work about Loango slaves history in Haiti
https://www.google.be/url?sa=t&rct=...33.pdf&usg=AFQjCNFYVnYbQ7eBCe50llbwDVyZzOgEOQ
African words origins in French Creole

Zombie: We give the origin of the word as West African and compares it to the Kikongo words "nzambi" (god) and "zumbi" (fetish). This root helps form the names of several deities, including the Kongo creator deity Nzambi a Mpungu and the Louisiana serpent deity Li Grand Zombi (a local version of the Haitian Damballa)

Calinda : it's a folk music and dance also practiced in Martinique, Guadeloupe and Trinidad and Tobagao; its roots are a martial art originating from Kingdom of Kongo (similar to capoeïra)

Méringue dance: a Kongo influence can be found in the persistent rhythmic figure that structured the melodies of the méringue, a syncopated five-beat pattern (often spoken as "dak-ta-dak-ta-dak") borrowed from the kata (time line) for the Vodou rhythm kongo and the rhythm used for carnival and rara bands, rabòday



Brazil
Central Africans slaves constituted about three-fifths of the slaves brought to Brazil.

Candomblé Bantu: It is one of the major branches of the Candomblé religious belief system. Its roots are originated from Kongo slaves who spoke Bantu (Kikongo and Kimbundu) languages.



A work about Central African Identities and Religiosity in colonial Minas Gerais

Jamaica
Kumina is a religion and practices that include secular ceremonies, dance and music that developed from the beliefs and traditions brought to the island by BaKongo enslaved people and indentured labourers, from the Congo region of West Central Africa. It's mostly practiced in the eastern part of Jamaica (parishes of St. Thomas, St. Mary, St. Catherine and Portland)



Jamaican Patois words of Kikongo origins
dingki
funeral ceremony
dundus
"albino", "white person", "European" from ndundu
djumbi
"ghost"
pinda
"peanut"
poto-poto
"mud", "muddy", also from Akan, Igbo and Yoruba

African etymologies of Jamaican Patois

african-lexicon-in-jamaica-2012.jpg
 

Marvolo

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Dominican Republic
It's estimated that half of the slaves brought to the Dominican Republic were Kongo people.

Palo music: its roots are in the Congo region, but it is also mixed with European influences in the melodies








Puerto Rico
Bozal Spanish: it is a possible extinct Spanish-based creole language that may have been a mixture of Spanish and Kikongo, with Portuguese influences.

Puerto Rico and Congo Spirituality

Colombia
Palenquero: it's a Spanish creole language spoken in Colombia. It was strongly influenced by the Kikongo language of Congo and Angola, and by Portuguese, the language of traders who brought African slaves in the 17th century. Kikongo-derived words like ngombe (cattle) and ngubá (peanut) remain in use here today.




Uruguay
Candombé Uruguayo: It's an Uruguayan music and dance genre. The term candombe means "pertaining to blacks" in Kikongo.


 
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Marvolo

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Cuba
Habla Congo: It's a Kongo-based liturgical language of the Palo religion with origins in Cuba

Palo Mayombe: Afro Cuban religion that take its roots to the Kongo people.




Conga music: "Congo" was the word used to designate African slaves brought to Cuba from the Congo region. According to the rules of Spanish grammar, "congo" became a masculine noun/adjective and its feminine counterpart was formed by changing final "o" to "a." This Spanish noun/adjective pair has been used in Cuba to designate anything pertaining to the above-mentioned African slaves and their culture.




Yuka music: it's a style of Cuban music and dance and a type of drum, of Congolese origin. The word Yuka is Bantu, and means 'to beat'.





Rumba: The term might have originated from a bantu language due to its similarity to other Afro-Caribbean words such as tumba, macumba, mambo and tambó

Juego de maní: It's a combined martial art and dance,related to capoeira and calinda in its african roots, as they derive from the Congo-Angola culture.


 

Marvolo

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Trinidad and Tobago
Moko Jumbee: It's a stilts walker or dancer. The word "jumbee" is a West Indian term for a ghost or spirit that may have been derived from the Kongo language word zumbi.

Kaiso: It has its origins in West Africa (particularly in present-day Nigeria) and in the Kingdom of Kongo and was brought over by the slaves who used it to sing about their masters. It later evoveld into calypso music.




United States



Congo Square: The name comes from the large number of enslaved africans from the Congo-Angola region that populated New Orleans in the beginning of the 19th century.

Gumbo: The etymology of the word comes from ochinggômbo in the Umbundu language (Angola) and chinggômbô in the Tshiluba language (DR Congo) meaning "okra".

Juba dance: It's an American style of dance that originated from Kongo slaves in Charleston, South Carolina.

Gullah words of Bantu origin

bidibidi: a small bird or a chicken, the word derives from the Kikongo language

guber/goober: meaning peanut derives from the Kikongo and Kimbundu word N'guba.

pinder: meaning peanut derives from the Kikongo word mpinda.


West Central African nature spirits in the South Carolina Lowcountry

African American Funeral and Mourning customs in South Carolina

African origins of the Melungeons: Kimbundu and Kongo roots
 
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AgnesGooch

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I saw this video the other day. It is of AAs dancing recorded in 1894. I don't know but I imagine it is probably one of the earliest recorded AAs on video.



Is this a Juba dance? It looks african in origin but I don't know. Never heard of juba dancing.
 

jx123

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Cool info I didn't know they had big influence like this. I always thought that West African countries were the major sole influence in the diaspora.

I'll ask my mom if she can point some of the stuff out. She's of the Baluba people.
 

BealieveIt

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A lot of Kongo influence was stifled in the U.S. after the Stono Rebellion. I wonder what our music would sound like if things were different.
 

Depoze Konpa

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A lot of Kongo influence was stifled in the U.S. after the Stono Rebellion. I wonder what our music would sound like if things were different.

Had to google that. First I heard of it! Wiki says they shipped the slaves they didn't execute off to the West Indies too. I wonder where they landed... I guess that's what they did to the ''difficult'' slaves...
 

Marvolo

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Thanks y'all for your messages. I'm of Congolese origin and I wanted to enlightened Kongo heritage in the americas because it's seems kinda overlooked by people.

I saw this video the other day. It is of AAs dancing recorded in 1894. I don't know but I imagine it is probably one of the earliest recorded AAs on video.



Is this a Juba dance? It looks african in origin but I don't know. Never heard of juba dancing.


I never heard of it either, it's an old dance and I read about it in a book about Africanism in American culture. Charleston dance takes its roots from juba dance, I forget to mention, it's probably more known.

Cool info I didn't know they had big influence like this. I always thought that West African countries were the major sole influence in the diaspora.

I'll ask my mom if she can point some of the stuff out. She's of the Baluba people.

That's great my mother is also Baluba. Actually West Central Africa (Angola and both Congo countries) were the largest source of slaves in the Americas but the vast majority went to Brazil.

lol are they saying the melungeons had origins in kongo?

At least their african roots are of Angolan descent (seems to be more Mbundu people than Kongo people though). They are also of European and Native Amerian origin
 

Marvolo

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A lot of Kongo influence was stifled in the U.S. after the Stono Rebellion. I wonder what our music would sound like if things were different.

You're right, they would probably brought more Kongo slaves if they were no Stono Rebellion. They still made about 25 % of enslaved africans in the U.S
 

Pearl Shay

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I uploaded some books on the topic. Great reads. I've included the pdfs in a zip file. This is one of my areas of research, and I've spent a lot of time working with the slave ship records, and it's actually 37% (about the same reported by later researchers..the first assumed numbers for enslaved Africans brought from different regions was wrong) who came from the Congo/Angola region. And a much, much higher number who were brought to Brazil. The other regions in the Americas? It varies. The number ended up being high in the US, because, during periods of time the numbers reached 70%. People make a lot of the VA Igbo connection and Carolinas Kongo connection, rigthfully, but in reality, both groups were brought to both areas (and Louisiana and that region of the south), just at different %s.

File: https://ufile.io/8f8oy

Texts:
Flash of the Spirit: African & Afro-American Art and Philosophy

Central Africans and Cultural Transformations in the American Diaspora

African Cosmology of the Bantu-Kongo: Tying the Spiritual Knot, Principles of Life & Living, 2nd Edition


LandofKam is a good blog, too, whose author is a Black man who makes the connection. We don't agree on everything and he leans more toward focus in areas I have no interest in, but still some good reads on there, where he talks about customs and art connected to Bakongo people that is found in African American churches and culture.
 

nycpapi

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I think you can get a idea of the genetic influence of the Kongo people by looking at this graph. Haiti seems to have the greatest contribution overall followed by African Americans.

jecx5yp.png
 

Depoze Konpa

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Dominican Republic
It's estimated that half of the slaves brought to the Dominican Republic were Kongo people.

Someone is gonna get REAL triggered by that information, OP. Someone who likes to refer to people as ''stocks''. Just giving you a heads up, lol.
 

Marvolo

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I uploaded some books on the topic. Great reads. I've included the pdfs in a zip file. This is one of my areas of research, and I've spent a lot of time working with the slave ship records, and it's actually 37% (about the same reported by later researchers..the first assumed numbers for enslaved Africans brought from different regions was wrong) who came from the Congo/Angola region. And a much, much higher number who were brought to Brazil. The other regions in the Americas? It varies. The number ended up being high in the US, because, during periods of time the numbers reached 70%. People make a lot of the VA Igbo connection and Carolinas Kongo connection, rigthfully, but in reality, both groups were brought to both areas (and Louisiana and that region of the south), just at different %s.

File: Uploadfiles.io - Congo.zip

Texts:
Flash of the Spirit: African & Afro-American Art and Philosophy

Central Africans and Cultural Transformations in the American Diaspora

African Cosmology of the Bantu-Kongo: Tying the Spiritual Knot, Principles of Life & Living, 2nd Edition

Wow that's great informations thanks, I tried to read one of these books on Google Books but all pages aren't available. How did you download it ?

There's also those books that I'd like to read:

Rituals of Resistance: African Atlantic Religion in Kongo and the Lowcountry South in the Era of Slavery

884279images.jpg



Central Africa in the Caribbean: Transcending Space, Transforming Culture

518R3CSPW3L._SY344_BO1,204,203,200_.jpg
 

Marvolo

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I think you can get a idea of the genetic influence of the Kongo people by looking at this graph. Haiti seems to have the greatest contribution overall followed by African Americans.

jecx5yp.png

yeah I know Fonte Felipe's works, it's actually afterwards his website that I started to do some research about enslaved africans from the Congo region but the number of dna results is small compared to the population of these countries (350 DNA results can't tell the average african origins of 42 million African Americans) but it allows to have some informations already and that's awesome.
 

Keyzzu

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I know Samba is believed to come from the traditional dance called Semba in Kikongo which I believe is still practiced in some regions of Congo and Angola. Semba translates to become one.
 

Lakay

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In Haiti, to be called a Kongo is an insult, I've heard the same about Guadeloupe. It's quite stupid, since the majority of the slaves were from there:
 

Pearl Shay

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Wow that's great informations thanks, I tried to read one of these books on Google Books but all pages aren't available. How did you download it ?

There's also those books that I'd like to read:

Rituals of Resistance: African Atlantic Religion in Kongo and the Lowcountry South in the Era of Slavery

884279images.jpg



Central Africa in the Caribbean: Transcending Space, Transforming Culture

518R3CSPW3L._SY344_BO1,204,203,200_.jpg

I have these. I find them here and there. There is a great Black site that uploads a ton of great books, too.


The second book: Uploadfiles.io - Maureen Warner-Lewis-Central Africa in the Caribbean_ Transcending Time, Transforming Cultures (2002).pdf

I have to see where I stored the 1st one.
 

Marvolo

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In Haiti, to be called a Kongo is an insult, I've heard the same about Guadeloupe. It's quite stupid, since the majority of the slaves were from there:


I heard that too, it's weird. The woman Marie-France Massembo even went to Congo Brazzaville to trace back her roots



What's interesting about Guadeloupe, Martinique and French Guyana, it's that Congo indentured servants brought in the 19th century kept their african names.

Kongo names in Martinique:
Acanda, Angola, Biombi, Bongou, Coma, Dila, Dongola, Goma, Kanza, Kimba, Lakouli, Landa, Mabiala, Macaya, Malenda, Malenga, Makabou, Makessa, Malouda, Matinda, Mvondo, Masso, Niama, Nisima, Sango, Vounzi, Womba, Yoka, Zaire, Zamba, Zebo, Zompa

Kongo names in Guadeloupe:
Choucoutu, Condé, Diboula, Dendelé, Dongal, Gombo, Loumengo, Massembo, N’Dendélé, Ndendé, N’Goma, N’guéla, Siba, Simba, Sombé, Soumbo, Tacita, Tagliamento, Pambo, Zodros
 

Depoze Konpa

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In Haiti, to be called a Kongo is an insult, I've heard the same about Guadeloupe. It's quite stupid, since the majority of the slaves were from there:


It wasn't the majority (Haiti). As the OP somewhat stated, it was a little less than half, and they were shipped in the second half of the slave trade, as whites started to penetrate the interior of the continent (which wasn't easy to do originally). Technically, the majority (by a small margin) comes from the Bight of Benin (shipped in the 1rst half). Af or Kongo being an insult, I guess that is white supremacist ideology at work, unfortunately...
 
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Afrelle

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Naza mwana ya mboka...well sort of lol. Grew up abroad, but always representing.

1vgqfs.gif


Great thread by the way! Will keep this one in my archives.
 

Kiku

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omg... Pinda is a word originally from Congo...?

Wow.... ! Yes, that's what we call peanuts in Suriname, too.. Because that's the word in Dutch, too, I just figured it was a Dutch word... !

We have lot's of other Congolese influences as well....
The word "Tata", apparently pemba/pimba may be from one of the Congolese languages as well. It's the Surinamese name for a white clay/kaolin, and Pemba means white?

And of course, religion wise there's a large influence... We refer to Congolese/Angolan ancestral spirits as Luangu. The Luangu were apparently a Congolese ethnic group.
These guys are singing in Surinamese to these Luangu spirits/ancestors. It's an old song, and kind of sad in a way. There's a phrase in the song, where they sing "Kongolongo, let's go to Matumba". Matumba is a region on Congo Kinshasa, but it could also refer to Matamba, the ancient (?) Congolese kingdom ruled by queen Nzinga (that was her kingdom right?).

They also say the word "Wayambe"... Does that sound like it could be from one of the Congolese languages?



Also, the name Ngina/Negina is very common in Suriname. Is that a Congolese name as well?
 

EatCake

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I saw this video the other day. It is of AAs dancing recorded in 1894. I don't know but I imagine it is probably one of the earliest recorded AAs on video.



Is this a Juba dance? It looks african in origin but I don't know. Never heard of juba dancing.

This reminds me of Chicago "FootWorking" dance.
 

Marvolo

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omg... Pinda is a word originally from Congo...?

Wow.... ! Yes, that's what we call peanuts in Suriname, too.. Because that's the word in Dutch, too, I just figured it was a Dutch word... !

We have lot's of other Congolese influences as well....
The word "Tata", apparently pemba/pimba may be from one of the Congolese languages as well. It's the Surinamese name for a white clay/kaolin, and Pemba means white?

And of course, religion wise there's a large influence... We refer to Congolese/Angolan ancestral spirits as Luangu. The Luangu were apparently a Congolese ethnic group.
These guys are singing in Surinamese to these Luangu spirits/ancestors. It's an old song, and kind of sad in a way. There's a phrase in the song, where they sing "Kongolongo, let's go to Matumba". Matumba is a region on Congo Kinshasa, but it could also refer to Matamba, the ancient (?) Congolese kingdom ruled by queen Nzinga (that was her kingdom right?).

They also say the word "Wayambe"... Does that sound like it could be from one of the Congolese languages?



Also, the name Ngina/Negina is very common in Suriname. Is that a Congolese name as well?


Thanks for the video. I didn't talk about Suriname and other Dutch Caribbean islands because I couldn't find any videos but you are right.

Africans origins in Suriname came mainly from Benin, Ghana and Loango (present day the Republic of Congo). Kongo people from the former Loango kingdom and Kongo kingdom were the most numerous but culturally speaking, Akan culture (Ghana) seems more dominant.

Suriname slaves origins Ghana, Benin, Loango

Slaves trading and slavery in the Dutch colonial Empire



african-origins-broad-regions-guyanas-fr-en-nl-numbers.jpg


african-origins-broad-regions-guyanas-fr-en-nl-against-other-origins.jpg


I don't speak Kikongo so I don't know what Wayambe could possibly mean but the etymology of the word seems like it's from a Bantu language (it remind me of the surname Kayembe or the Mayombe region).
 

Kiku

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Thanks for the video. I didn't talk about Suriname and other Dutch Caribbean islands because I couldn't find any videos but you are right.

.

Thank you ! Ohw, just search for Luangu winti or just just Luangu Suriname , and you'll find numerous songs. A lot of the songs have phrases that I don't recognize as Surinamese, so they're probably Kikongo (or another language)
 

Marvolo

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Thank you ! Ohw, just search for Luangu winti or just just Luangu Suriname , and you'll find numerous songs. A lot of the songs have phrases that I don't recognize as Surinamese, so they're probably Kikongo (or another language)



Interesting, what language is it ?
I don't recognize Dutch, is it creole ?
 

Kiku

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Interesting, what language is it ?
I don't recognize Dutch, is it creole ?

Yes, it's Surinamese/Sranantongo the Surinamese Creole language...

The title translates to" Luangu Negroes, we don't have a head" (in this case, I think he means king or leader), and then he continues in the song "Dance makes us not bother/trouble them/the others"

ETA; (but Sranan of that era (it's an old song) can be very cryptic, so see this as a literal translation, who knows what they actually mean. And excuse the use of "negro", I just translated it literally)

Another one , which is probably only in Kikongo, since I don't understand anything...lol.. There are so many Luangu Surinamese songs...



And a bonus, a Surinamese/Congolese Angolan family...(the mom is from Suriname, and the father is Congolese/Angolan). The children were tested by their Congolese grandmom on their Lingala skills...

at 07:46
 
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201520162017

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This is fascinating information, thanks! My ancestors on my father side are from a Louisiana parish that is documented to have most of it's enslaved african population come from the "Congo", so I suspected I definitely have some Congo ancestry. Cameroon/Congo was also the highest percentage region wise on my AncestryDNA test.
 

Marvolo

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This is fascinating information, thanks! My ancestors on my father side are from a Louisiana parish that is documented to have most of it's enslaved african population come from the "Congo", so I suspected I definitely have some Congo ancestry. Cameroon/Congo was also the highest percentage region wise on my AncestryDNA test.

That's great. What parish is your father coming from ?

About Louisiana, the author Kevin David Roberts called the large influx of West Central Africans enslaved in Louisiana during the beginning of the 19th century: the Congolization.

Slaves and Slavery in Louisiana: The evolution of Atlantic world identities, 1791-1831

Slaves from the Congo region came:

Via Charleston, SC

Via Haitians who are mostly of Congo and Beninese descent and immigrated after the Haitian Revolution

Via Afro-cuban who are mostly of Congo and Yoruba descent
 

201520162017

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That's great. What parish is your father coming from ?

About Louisiana, the author Kevin David Roberts called the large influx of West Central Africans enslaved in Louisiana during the beginning of the 19th century: the Congolization.

Slaves and Slavery in Louisiana: The evolution of Atlantic world identities, 1791-1831

Slaves from the Congo region came:

Via Charleston, SC

Via Haitians who are mostly of Congo and Beninese descent and immigrated after the Haitian Revolution

Via Afro-cuban who are mostly of Congo and Yoruba descent

Avoyelles Parish. I also have some ancestors who immigrated from Haiti
 

gonaive

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That's great. What parish is your father coming from ?

About Louisiana, the author Kevin David Roberts called the large influx of West Central Africans enslaved in Louisiana during the beginning of the 19th century: the Congolization.

Slaves and Slavery in Louisiana: The evolution of Atlantic world identities, 1791-1831

Slaves from the Congo region came:

Via Charleston, SC

Via Haitians who are mostly of Congo and Beninese descent and immigrated after the Haitian Revolution

Via Afro-cuban who are mostly of Congo and Yoruba descent
For the bolded part ,did you run a dna test to the whole haitian population or you 're just going by your assumptions ?I've seen many haitians taking these dna test and they were mostly west african and cameroon /congo was not the highest percentage region wise ...
Then you mentionned before that after fon ,the kikongo language was the most influential in haitian kreyol .Actually ,no linguist has confirmed this . Pierre Vernet and Pradelle pompilus who are both of haitian descent said that haitian kreyol have been mostly influenced by fon ,wolof,Ewé,nago (yoruba),igbo ,soso ,mandé ...C .Febvre a canadian linguist said haitian kreyol owns its whole structure to fon ,éwé ,adja ,no mention to kikongo ... Only creole from gwadloup is heavily influenced by kikongo and umbundu (Angola) according to Dr Ama mazama who is from Guadeloupe herself ...
Our ancestors in Ayiti used to call their country in Africa Ginen ad it is a sussu and mandinka word ..."Depi nan Ginen gen bon nèg ,gen mové nèg" .... Even the word "rele " in kijan ou rele " which means what's your name came from sussu "i rele di ... or mandinka "a wele" ....
Even our national hero like Toussaint trace his roots directly to Benin ....I'm not saying there 's no kongo influence at all but it's not that huge ,at least according to experts,it's among others ...

As for Vodoun ,many westeners wrote books on this religion when they are not even initiated ...Damballah wedo is a divinity from the fon "pantheon" ...Rara as in rara music ,the word itself means "noise " in nago (yoruba) from Benin as the instruments such as caracas were used by tainos and africans ...
There 's Something I notice you won't see Senegalese ,malians ,guineans or ivorians claim the americas like some congolese or nigerians do ..it's like a badge of honor ,it's weird lol
 
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Marvolo

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For the bolded part ,did you run a dna test to the whole haitian population or you 're just going by your assumptions ?I've seen many haitians taking these dna test and they were mostly west african and cameroon /congo was not the highest percentage region wise ...
Then you mentionned before that after fon ,the kikongo language was the most influential in haitian kreyol .Actually ,no linguist has confirmed this . Pierre Vernet and Pradelle pompilus who are both of haitian descent said that haitian kreyol have been mostly influenced by fon ,wolof,Ewé,nago (yoruba),igbo ,soso ,mandé ...C .Febvre a canadian linguist said haitian kreyol owns its whole structure to fon ,éwé ,adja ,no mention to kikongo ... Only creole from gwadloup is heavily influenced by kikongo and umbundu (Angola) according to Dr Ama mazama who is from Guadeloupe herself ...
Our ancestors in Ayiti used to call their country in Africa Ginen ad it is a sussu and mandinka word ..."Depi nan Ginen gen bon nèg ,gen mové nèg" .... Even the word "rele " in kijan ou rele " which means what's your name came from sussu "i rele di ... or mandinka "a wele" ....
Even our national hero like Toussaint trace his roots directly to Benin ....I'm not saying there 's no kongo influence at all but it's not that huge ,at least according to experts,it's among others ...

As for Vodoun ,many westeners wrote books on this religion when they are not even initiated ...Damballah wedo is a divinity from the fon "pantheon" ...Rara as in rara music ,the word itself means "noise " in nago (yoruba) from Benin as the instruments such as caracas were used by tainos and africans ...
There 's Something I notice you won't see Senegalese ,malians ,guineans or ivorians claim the americas like some congolese or nigerians do ..it's like a badge of honor ,it's weird lol

All I say is based on the books I read, the links I posted and the analysis on the dna tests done on tracingafricanroots.com

If by West Africa you mean all the countries from Senegal to Nigeria, then yes of course is a bigger region than Congo-Angola.


I've watch dna test results of Haitians, most of the times is Benin/Togo and Cameroon/Congo as the largest percentages. Don't forget also that African southeatern bantu could also mean Angolan and/or interior Congolese roots.

I know haitian kreyol is a blend of different west african languages. Did you watch the link that I posted about words of african roots in French creole ?

Some region like the north of Haiti were heavily populated by Kongo people, so maybe it depends on the region. It's only in the recent decades that historians have been focusing about the Kongo influence, usually they only care about West Africa because indeed combined it's a bigger region.

About the African Ginen, I have a theory about it, I think is because the first slaves brought in Saint Domingue were from Senegal and Guineas so that's why it might come from, but in the first half of the 18th century, the French brought more slaves from Benin and then in the second half of the 18th century, even more slaves from the Congo. Also it was consider as an insult to be called Congo so people tended to deny their roots.

About Senegalese and guineans not claming the americas, they were far more slaves from Nigeria (estimated 1.6 million) and Congo/Angola (estimated 5 million) in America than Senegalese (estimated 750 000) and Congolese/Nigerian slaves came until mid 19th century while slaves from upper guinea came mostly in the 17th & 18th century. That's why they are more visible influences of Yoruba and Kongo culture.
 
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gonaive

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All I say is based on the books I read, the links I posted and the analysis on the dna tests done on tracingafricanroots.com

If by West Africa you mean all the countries from Senegal to Nigeria, then yes of course is a bigger region than Congo-Angola.


I've watch dna test results of Haitians, most of the times is Benin/Togo and Cameroon/Congo as the largest percentages. Don't forget also that African southeatern bantu could also mean Angolan and/or interior Congolese roots.

I know haitian kreyol is a blend of different west african languages. Did you watch the link that I posted about words of african roots in French creole ?

Some region like the north of Haiti were heavily populated by Kongo people, so maybe it depends on the region. It's only in the recent decades that historians have been focusing about the Kongo influence, usually they only care about West Africa because indeed combined it's a bigger region.

About the African Ginen, from Senegal and Guineas so that's why it might come from, but in I have a theory about it, I think is because the first slaves brought in Saint Domingue were the first half of the 18th century, the French brought more slaves from Benin and then in the second half of the 18th century, even more slaves from the Congo. Also it was consider as an insult to be called Congo so people tended to deny their roots.

About Senegalese and guineans not claming the americas, they were far more slaves from Nigeria (estimated 1.6 million) and Congo/Angola (estimated 5 million) in America than Senegalese (estimated 750 000) and Congolese/Nigerian slaves came until mid 19th century while slaves from upper guinea came mostly in the 17th & 18th century. That's why they are more visible influences of Yoruba and Kongo culture.
Why don't you post these so called dna test with high "Cameroun /congo ? Jimmy jean louis was tested and he matched the mende people ,another haitian youtuber named jasmine rose ,same thing and the list goes on !you can even find a thread about diasporas dna test ... I saw the link you posted and it said the same ,haitian kreyol and kreyol from martinik are ewé influenced and kikongo did not influence this language more than other parts of Africa ... By the way "french creole" means Nothing at all ,french and kreyol are two different languages,this link was more about creole spoken in those islands who are still Under french colonial rulenot Haiti ...I trust linguists and experts more and no kikongo is not more influential in haitian kreyol than the other influences and the structure is based on fon language . "I have a theory " like you said it's not about your theory it 's about historians ,experts ,linguists analyzis and works not approximative assumptions,Ginen is actually a mystic place in the voudoisant community but you won't see guineans try to claim vodou ,vodou original place is benin ,not even beninese are obsessed with the americas or busy claiming haitian culture like you lol ...Sorry but I don't see that kongo heavy influence not in haiti at least and the experts I mentionned as well ..."some region in the north " sources ? or again your assumptions ...Senegalese or other africans tend to focus more on their own culture ,they don't have this obsession over the "americas" and they don't lecture people on their own culture ! In some part of the americas ,bantus were numerous but they still didn't influence these cultures ,it's not numbers ,it's influence ! "Haitian creole is a blend of different west african languages " okay that's your own definition then ...Like I told you before a lot of non haitians wrote about vodou or haitian culture and they are no experts ...
 
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Keyzzu

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Why don't you post these so called dna test with high "Cameroun /congo ? Jimmy jean louis was tested and he matched the mende people ,another haitian youtuber named jasmine rose ,same thing and the list goes on !you can even find a thread about diasporas dna test ... I saw the link you posted and it said the same ,haitian kreyol and kreyol from martinik are ewé influenced and kikongo did not influence this language more than other parts of Africa ... By the way "french creole" means Nothing at all ,french and kreyol are two different languages,this link was more about creole spoken in those islands who are still Under french colonial rulenot Haiti ...I trust linguists and experts more and no kikongo is not more influential in haitian kreyol than the other influences and the structure is based on fon language . "I have a theory " like you said it's not about your theory it 's about historians ,experts ,linguists analyzis and works not approximative assumptions,Ginen is actually a mystic place in the voudoisant community but you won't see guineans try to claim vodou ,vodou original place is benin ,not even beninese are obsessed with the americas or busy claiming haitian culture like you lol ...Sorry but I don't see that kongo heavy influence not in haiti at least and the experts I mentionned as well ..."some region in the north " sources ? or again your assumptions ...Senegalese or other africans tend to focus more on their own culture ,they don't have this obsession over the "americas" and they don't lecture people on their own culture ! In some part of the americas ,bantus were numerous but they still didn't influence these cultures ,it's not numbers ,it's influence ! "Haitian creole is a blend of different west african languages " okay that's your own definition then ...Like I told you before a lot of non haitians wrote about vodou or haitian culture and they are no experts ...
I rarely see congolese people claim people in the Americas... if anything I'd say that most are very ignorant to the extent of the impact of the Kongo Kingdom in the Americas so I don't know why you're acting as if this is common within Congolese and Angolan people. I assure you that if you speak to most you will find the same
 

gonaive

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I rarely see congolese people claim people in the Americas... if anything I'd say that most are very ignorant to the extent of the impact of the Kongo Kingdom in the Americas so I don't know why you're acting as if this is common within Congolese and Angolan people. I assure you that if you speak to most you will find the same
It 's not the first time I read or hear this coming from a congolese .A few years ago ,a so called "fake" historian of congolese descent was trying to rewrite the whole haitian history pretending that in fact the whole Benin influence on haitian culture was fake and that it was in fact congolese lol ...Anyway ...that most haitians were from Congo ,trying to claim haitian freedom fighters like Mackandal among others when this man was actually a muslim ,sorcerer probably from the mandinka tribe and he had a huge knowledge of medicinal plants ...
 

Keyzzu

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It 's not the first time I read or hear this coming from a congolese .A few years ago ,a so called "fake" historian of congolese descent was trying to rewrite the whole haitian history pretending that in fact the whole Benin influence on haitian culture was fake and that it was in fact congolese lol ...Anyway ...that most haitians were from Congo ,trying to claim haitian freedom fighters like Mackandal among others when this man was actually a muslim ,sorcerer probably from the mandinka tribe and he had a huge knowledge of medicinal plants ...

So from two Congolese people out of 90 million people you were able to deduce that we are all obsessed with claiming cultural aspects in the Americas...

You can't look at two people and make the huge generalizations. I've come across many Congolese people that even believed that their ancestors were not a part of the Atlantic Slave Trade. This is the first thread I've ever seen talking about the cultural impact of the Kongo Kingdom. So once again, stop generalizing
 

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