The "jumped the shark"/when the show startet going astray thread

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I wanted to start a thread about this, because it seems to be coming up in every other thread lately.

This show has Viola Davis and that's always a redeeming quality - to a point. I completely skipped Annalise's arc in jail episodes because I had no use for the torture porn they were.
And yes Viola is too good for this show to a point it's not even funny anymore.

Having said that I really liked what this show was like originally. I like the mystery and I like the mini mysteries that were the cases of the week. It also conveniently kept the cheap melodrama to a minimum. But I did like the messiness that stem from the main characters being involved in all of it.

I had no issues with either Annalise or Wes at the center of the narrative. Why Sam had to die and why it was ok for them to get away with it worked for me - they always painted law enforcement as corrupted/uninterested in actual justice, not coincidently Annalise's clients were predominantly innocent.
And frankly I didn't think Sam was worthy of Wes' life being ruined over him.
This was also how the show was written up to the 1st midseason finale.

Right after that the show started changing course. They started downplaying the roles most had in Sam's death while overstating the responsibilities of Annalise and Wes (this may sound weird but before Wes delivers the fatal blow to Sam he is urged by all of them to do something and at that point they assumed Sam was already dead by somebody else's hand, Connor enthusiastically decimated Sam's remains and was responsible for the crappy job they did at disposing of Sam's remains - meaning they wrote the events in a way that makes them all ultimately responsible).
They even half redeem Sam with every flashback. He tends to be depicted as the long suffering husband of the evil bitch that is Annalise.

They created this antagonistic dynamic that made Wes and Annalise to be the bad guys while Connor, Frank, Oliver and occasionally Laurel, Asher and Bonnie the good guys, though they're far more consistent with the first 3.
This is where they started loosing because what they were pushing never worked for me. It doesn't even make sense within the storyline either.
This is most obvious around Frank. Frank being Lila's killer means he is directly responsible (with Sam) for all the fuckery that happened for the get go.
Frank and Sam were the only two people who could stop everything starting with Rebecca being accused (or Lila being murdered) of the murder and Annalise going crazy over her suspicions over Sam being involved.
But that never translated into the show, except for one snarky remark made by Laurel.
With everything that was revealed about Frank's role in Annalise loosing her son, while Wes and Anna were being vilified usually through Connor, it only made the show less appealing to me.

With this the actual narrative, what each character did or was responsible for, lost all importance to the alleged popularity of the characters. The writers and part of the audience sided with who they liked, completely disregarding the actual events in the show.
It seems to be a show that only really works with a certain set of biases, racial above all.
When Wes was revealed to be dead all the impressions I had about the show (and Pete Nowalk as the showrunner) were confirmed. As much of a problem as I had with Wes being killed off (and trust me I have a ton of them starting with the lack of character exploration and "humanisation" scenes especially compared to other characters and the elitists undertones since they got rid of all the "poor" characters) I always insisted it was about Annalise too - not coincidentally a couple of months later Pete would be stating in interviews how he plans to move the show from Annalise's world to Jorge's and publications like Dateline were speculating that Viola's role may be reduced in the 4th season.

Laurel has become insufferable (she's been useless before to be honest) but it's because they turned her in a plot device-punchline like they did with Wes. Note the "it's your faults" directed at her. It's pretty much the same thing they did with Wes. I wouldn't really mind her storyline if it was well written and developed but it's not and again for the same reasons as always. I found her boning Frank in extremely poor taste, and I really find it intolerable how Connor and Oliver get into their meltdowns and blame games when they're so untouchable they haven't really been affected by everything that happened in the show.
Michaela is of course reduced to the best friend trope so I can't really blame the character for the writers being, uhm ,"old fashioned".

The minute the most important thing in the show became things always working out for Connor, Oliver, Frank and Asher, they lost me in short. They aren't interesting enough for me, nor are they important to the narrative enough for it to feel justified and it's actually arguably deeply problematic.
 
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HTGAWM has definitely jumped the shark. Although I am enjoying the commentary threads with you all, the show itself is really being dragged down by this Laurel storyline. I knew once Wes died and it became the "Laurel Show", I knew the storyline quality would start to fall and jump the shark. The writers and directors really need to get it together because they are going to continue to lose viewership because of this Laurel nonsense. I am going to hang on as long as I can because the commentary thread is A1.


Scandal jumped the shark when it became heavily focused on the Olivia/Fitz relationship. I remember when it use to be about the cases that Olivia and them worked on and the personal relatioships were secondary. That show jumped the shark once it because Olivia and Fitz first and then everything else was secondary. It's dying a slow death in its final season.
 
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The show began slipping when they wrote Laurel and Wes as a couple, but it officially jumped the shark when they decided to make Laurel's pregnancy a storyline. The producers should have never written a pregnancy storyline into the show for anyone.

The Michaela/Laurel best friend storyline is odd as hell, because they were never close from the jump. It was always Michaela and Connor, so I dont know where the hell Pete Nowalk came from with this bullshit.

This season is low key racist, with everyone dropping everything in their lives to fight for the poor white girl, including the damn MAIN CHARACTER.
 
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I stopped watching HTGAWM after season 1 because I knew where it was going and I drop out of shows when I sense bullshit coming.

Most of ABC's shows do this for some reason, they have a great premise and then fall apart at the end of season 2 which doesn't make sense but whatever.
 
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HTGAWM has definitely jumped the shark. Although I am enjoying the commentary threads with you all, the show itself is really being dragged down by this Laurel storyline. I knew once Wes died and it became the "Laurel Show", I knew the storyline quality would start to fall and jump the shark. The writers and directors really need to get it together because they are going to continue to lose viewership because of this Laurel nonsense. I am going to hang on as long as I can because the commentary thread is A1.


Scandal jumped the shark when it became heavily focused on the Olivia/Fitz relationship. I remember when it use to be about the cases that Olivia and them worked on and the personal relatioships were secondary. That show jumped the shark once it because Olivia and Fitz first and then everything else was secondary. It's dying a slow death in its final season.
Both this show and Scandal had a dramatic fall from grace and ABC/Shondaland just doesn't seem to get it.
 
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The show began slipping when they wrote Laurel and Wes as a couple, but the show officially jumped the shark when they decided to make Laurel's pregnancy a storyline. The producers should have never written a pregnancy storyline into the show for anyone.

The Michaela/Laurel best friend storyline is odd as hell, because they were never close from the jump. It was always Michaela and Connor, so I dont know where the hell Pete Nowalk came from with this bullshit.

This season is low key racist, with everyone dropping everything in their lives to fight for the poor white girl, including the damn MAIN CHARACTER.
Michaela's friendship with Connor came from the same place the one with Laurel did. She was there to prop up them.
Michaela's lines in S1-S3 used to be mostly what Connor said/yes Connor, while Connor threated her like shit.
The only reason people gave it a pass is because they liked Connor more than they do Laurel, while Michaela's writing is equally screwed by both.
 
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Both this show and Scandal had a dramatic fall from grace and ABC/Shondaland just doesn't seem to get it.

This show used to be so good, and it makes me angry to see how much it has fallen off. Viola deserves better. I will continue to watch in support, but I hope the writers get it together. It will take a miracle to undo the mess they have made.
 
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Private Practice jumped the shark when Addison started dating Sam, and Naomi just..accepted it. What the fuck kinda best friend is that?
 
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Both this show and Scandal had a dramatic fall from grace and ABC/Shondaland just doesn't seem to get it.


You can say that again. And the sad thing was that both shows had so much potential to be better than what they are now. I'm disappointed that they have become sort of like nighttime soap operas. I expected better from both shows.
 
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This show used to be so good, and it makes me angry to see how much it has fallen off. Viola deserves better. I will continue to watch in support, but I hope the writers get it together. It will take a miracle to undo the mess they have made.
I found that really obvious in the Annalise-Bonnie scene. They were dead serious recalling this absurd events in their lives. You can't take seriously that much of a mess, but they expect you to.
 
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Michaela's friendship with Connor came from the same place the one with Laurel did. She was there to prop up them.
Michaela's line in S1-S3 used to be mostly what Connor said/yes Connor, while Connor threated her like shit.
The only reason people gave it a pass is because they liked Connor more than they do Laurel, while Michaela's writing is equally screwed by both.

Connor was always a miserable, shady queen, but I don't feel as if this friendship was written to prop up his character, at least not in the way they are doing it with Laurel. If anything, I'd say his relationship with Oliver was written for that purpose.
 
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You can say that again. And the sad thing was that both shows had so much potential to be better than what they are now. I'm disappointed that they have become sort of like nighttime soap operas. I expected better from both shows.
That's another thing ABC/Shondaland doesn't seem to get. There doesn't seem to be as much apetite for this type of soaps, especially sordid affair type melodrama, as they believe.
 
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For me the show started going down hill on season 2 but I still enjoyed it with it's flaws. I thought season 3 was pretty bad but this season here takes the cake. The official jumping the shark moment for me was when the baby was kidnapped.

They definitely do white-wash Sam every time they bring him back. Season 2 was okay but now he's basically a saint as if he didn't order the death of his pregnant woman..

At first I didn't mind Wes being killed of but then I realized there was no thought or reason to it. He was killed off for no good reason and they are dragging it out to keep the last of the viewers watching.

Taking away the classes and cases did nothing but hurt the show. Without those two things that leaves the rest of the cast doing nothing but bitching and causing problems for AK which I imagine is what Pete wants. He likes Annalise being alone and miserable. Do you remember the last time Annalise smiled? The so called mystery of season has become a joke too. I always loved Annalise and Bonnie scenes but Pete went and made their backstory horrible. Nate is pointless and Frank does nothing but screw Laurel.

At minimum we got see Viola act her ass off now she's been sidelined on her own show. I will still make the weekly threads but I'm no longer watching this show. Last week's episode was the lowest viewed of the series and I'm sure it will continue to fall with the focus on The Castillos. I'm just waiting to hear that's been canceled because Pete has no problem with how the show is. He doesn't even acknowledge the ratings drop.
 
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Connor was always a miserable, shady queen, but I don't feel as if this friendship was written to prop up his character, at least not in the way they are doing it with Laurel. If anything, I'd say his relationship with Oliver was written for that purpose.
Because Connor and Laurel have different storylines. And Pete will never give Connor a Laurel type storyline because he is always the one patronising the characters who are given this type of storylines.
Michaela didn't have to do anything for Connor but each time he would go into one of his rants against either Annalise or Wes there was Michaela reinforcing his position - never the other way around. Same thing for when he tried to snitch after Sam was killed- Michaela was there to reinforce his position.
Even when Caleb shows Michaela the gun first thing she does is call Connor to tell her what to do.

I always found this against character for Michaela too.
 
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Taking away the classes and cases did nothing but hurt the show. Without those two things that leaves the rest of the cast doing nothing but bitching and causing problems for AK which I imagine is what Pete wants. I always loved to Annalise and Bonnie together but Pete went and made their backstory horrible. Nate is pointless and Frank does nothing but screw Laurel.
And notice what taking away the classes and cases (and the house and Wes) does - it reduces Annalise's role.
 
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Private Practice jumped the shark when Addison started dating Sam, and Naomi just..accepted it. What the fuck kinda best friend is that?
Chile you done triggered something in my spirit on this here Sunday...I am STILL pissed about what they did to Private Practice. I need some liquor now...
 
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I agree with HTGAWM being done after Wes. First they put Wes with Laurel who is about as interesting as a rock, he had better chemistry with the chalkboard in the classroom, and because I'm pretty she got a head like Blinky from Arthur and was not deserving of Wes :arrogant:. Then to add insult to injury they kill him off. I really could have fought the writers on that show. I feel like they were trying to pander to the Latino audience putting Laurel in the forefront, there's literally no reason why her character is suddenly of any importance on the show. They were/are really stretching trying to make fetch happen with her.

Scandal jumped shark but somehow came fighting back with Papa and Mama Pope. They need to pay them bonuses, they make the show interesting.
 
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I agree with HTGAWM being done after Wes. First they put Wes with Laurel who is about as interesting as a rock, he had better chemistry with the chalkboard in the classroom, and because I'm pretty she got a head like Blinky from Arthur and was not deserving of Wes :arrogant:. Then to add insult to injury they kill him off. I really could have fought the writers on that show. I feel like they were trying to pander to the Latino audience putting Laurel in the forefront, there's literally no reason why her character is suddenly of any importance on the show. They were/are really stretching trying to make fetch happen with her.

Scandal jumped shark but somehow came fighting back with Papa and Mama Pope. They need to pay them bonuses, they make the show interesting.
I don't think they would be trying to pander to the Latino audience by making the Latina character intolerable.
The other Latino characters aren't that flattering of a depiction either, so I'm not sure.
 
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Connor was always a miserable, shady queen, but I don't feel as if this friendship was written to prop up his character, at least not in the way they are doing it with Laurel. If anything, I'd say his relationship with Oliver was written for that purpose.
oh yeah this reminds me


Oliver is useless. Completely and utterly
 
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Not long before Wes died. The show stopped holding my attention. Laurel & Wes made no sense, neither does Michaela & Asher. It's background noise at this point, everything is a mess

This could've been a great long running show
 
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For me the show started going down hill on season 2 but I still enjoyed it with it's flaws. I thought season 3 was pretty bad but this season hear takes the cake. The official jumping the shark moment for me was when the baby was kidnapped.

They definitely do white-wash Sam every time they bring him back. Season 2 was okay but now he's basically a saint as if he didn't order the death of his pregnant woman..

At first I didn't mind Wes being killed of but then I realized there was no thought or reason to it. He was killed off for no good reason and they are dragging it out to keep the last of the viewers watching.

Taking away the classes and cases did nothing but hurt the show. Without those two things that leaves the rest of the cast doing nothing but bitching and causing problems for AK which I imagine is what Pete wants. He likes Annalise being alone miserable. Do you remember the last time Annalise smiled? The so called mystery of season has become a joke. I always loved Annalise and Bonnie scenes but Pete went and made their backstory horrible. Nate is pointless and Frank does nothing but screw Laurel.

At minimum we got see Viola act her ass off now she's been sidelined on her own show. I will still make the weekly threads but I'm no longer watching this show. Last week's episode was the lowest viewed of the series and I'm sure it will continue to fall with the focus on The Castillos. I'm just waiting to hear that's been canceled because Pete has no problem with how the show is. He doesn't even acknowledge the ratings drop.

For me, the best part of the show was always watching the dynamic between Bonnie and Annalise. This new dynamic makes no sense, and it ruined this whole season.
You expect me to believe that Annalise cares more about getting in the good graces of Laurel, than she does making up with Bonnie?

Next season needs to be it's last.
 
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Not long before Wes died. The show stopped holding my attention. Laurel & Wes made no sense, neither does Michaela & Asher. It's background noise at this point, everything is a mess

This could've been a great long running show
They should have never started giving so much weight on any of the ships. Originally they were barely D-storylines, but after the first midseason finale they started taking over.
 
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I was done the second wes died. My mom was done when Anna started making out with that white woman
I will not have this Eve slander. :arrogant They could have been great if Pete Nowalk Annalise wasn't full of shit. :CryAnna hasn't smiled once sense she left.
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The show began slipping when they wrote Laurel and Wes as a couple, but it officially jumped the shark when they decided to make Laurel's pregnancy a storyline. The producers should have never written a pregnancy storyline into the show for anyone.

The Michaela/Laurel best friend storyline is odd as hell, because they were never close from the jump. It was always Michaela and Connor, so I dont know where the hell Pete Nowalk came from with this bullshit.

This season is low key racist, with everyone dropping everything in their lives to fight for the poor white girl, including the damn MAIN CHARACTER
.

ALL OF THIS.

But the bolded especially. What irked me the most in the last episode was when Annalise told Michaela to skip class to watch Laurel. I was like what type of bullsh*t is that? They aren't tight like that so on top of them making Michaela fck up a potential career opportunity, she's gonna further screw up her legal education too? And for some fake ass friendship with Laurel? Whaaaa?

And I agree about the racist part. Its subtle but its noticeable and I notice it too in the fanbase on reddit, twitter and tumblr smh.

Pete's whole decision to kill Wes was because he wanted to reset the show for some type of "clean slate". But it doesn't seem like that at all or that he even knows what to do with the characters anymore. Maybe its time to bring in some new writers perhaps because the whole kidnap the baby thing is very soap opera like and if they are gonna go that route then go all in and do the whole Wes faked his death thing because its still gonna be a mess.
 
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ALL OF THIS.

But the bolded especially. What irked me the most in the last episode was when Annalise told Michaela to skip class to watch Laurel. I was like what type of bullsh*t is that? They aren't tight like that so on top of them making Michaela fck up a potential career opportunity, she's gonna further screw up her legal education too? And for some fake ass friendship with Laurel? Whaaaa?

And I agree about the racist part. Its subtle but its noticeable and I notice it too in the fanbase on reddit, twitter and tumblr smh.

Pete's whole decision to kill Wes was because he wanted to reset the show for some type of "clean slate". But it doesn't seem like that at all or that he even knows what to do with the characters anymore. Maybe its time to bring in some new writers perhaps because the whole kidnap the baby thing is very soap opera like and if they are gonna go that route then go all in and do the whole Wes faked his death thing because its still gonna be a mess.

Exactly. Where is this clean slate? I have yet to see it.
 

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