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The ten commandments...take two.

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V Hexerei

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Not too long ago, a judge in an Alabama court of law fought to keep the ten commandments posted in the state supreme court building. Of course, his wishes were disregarded and the monument came down. Now this was a good thing because this country is founded on the principle that the government will not honor any particular religion over another...I.E.-separation of church and state. unless they were will to erect monuments to every other religious belief in the country, it had to take it down.

However, the ten commandments listed on the monument were not the final set handed down in the bible, so why were they all up in arms when they were not even honoring the correct rules???

Here is the ten commandments that most people know. They were given to moses in Exodus 20

1. I am the Lord your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage. You shall have no other gods before me.

2. You shall not make for yourself a graven image. You shall not bow down to them or serve them.

3. You shall not take the name of the Lord your God in vain.

4. Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy.

5. Honor your father and your mother.

6. You shall not kill.

7. You shall not commit adultery.

8. You shall not steal.

9. You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.

10. You shall not covet.

However, when Moses came down and saw everyone dancing, drinking, and gallivanting, he got mad and broke the tablets. Mad at himself, he goes back up the mountain and requests the commandments again. This time, in Exodus 34, god gave him a new list!

1. Thou shalt worship no other god (For the Lord is a jealous god).

2. Thou shalt make thee no molten gods.

3. The feast of unleavened bread shalt thou keep in the month when the ear is on the corn.

4. All the first-born are mine.

5. Six days shalt thou work, but on the seventh thou shalt rest.

6. Thou shalt observe the feast of weeks, even of the first fruits of the wheat harvest, and the feast of in gathering at the year's end.

7. Thou shalt not offer the blood of my sacrifice with leavened bread.

8. The fat of my feast shall not remain all night until the morning.

9. The first of the first fruits of thy ground thou shalt bring unto the house of the Lord thy God.

10. Thou shalt not seethe a kid in its mother's milk.


Now some of those look familiar, but some of them are nothing like the original. So why would people get up in arms when the version that was removed was wrong to begin with?
And why is it that most christians still follow (or pretend to follow) the commandments that were clearly replaced with new ones?? Discuss
 

Caelum07

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You gonna go make me break out my bible....
Ill be back
*leaves thread*
 

Dyme Peaze

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1. Thou shalt worship no other god (For the Lord is a jealous god).

Ok- So if your the only God, what difference does it make ? Hmm smart guy ?

2. Thou shalt make thee no molten gods.

So graven is ok now. Kewl beans God
icon13.gif


4. All the first-born are mine.

Um'Kay....Rumplestiltskin...

8. The fat of my feast shall not remain all night until the morning.

If youd climb down off your high horse and eat it, It woudnt be any left in the morning. Duh!

9. The first of the first fruits of thy ground thou shalt bring unto the house of the Lord thy God.

Oh, Now its okay. After all that sh!t you put Cain through, Able being slew and all.

Girl stop this foolishness @ once.

Uh, So now its okay to steal, and lie, and murder. As long as you have the feasts at the appropiate time of year.......M'Kayy.....yeah
 

Probowl

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In an attempt to confuse you the other poster did not post what it actually says in the bible.

Exodus 34
The New Stone Tablets
1 The LORD said to Moses, "Chisel out two stone tablets like the first ones, and I will write on them the words that were on the first tablets, which you broke. 2 Be ready in the morning, and then come up on Mount Sinai. Present yourself to me there on top of the mountain. 3 No one is to come with you or be seen anywhere on the mountain; not even the flocks and herds may graze in front of the mountain."
4 So Moses chiseled out two stone tablets like the first ones and went up Mount Sinai early in the morning, as the LORD had commanded him; and he carried the two stone tablets in his hands. 5 Then the LORD came down in the cloud and stood there with him and proclaimed his name, the LORD. 6 And he passed in front of Moses, proclaiming, "The LORD, the LORD, the compassionate and gracious God, slow to anger, abounding in love and faithfulness, 7 maintaining love to thousands, and forgiving wickedness, rebellion and sin. Yet he does not leave the guilty unpunished; he punishes the children and their children for the sin of the fathers to the third and fourth generation."

8 Moses bowed to the ground at once and worshiped. 9 "O Lord, if I have found favor in your eyes," he said, "then let the Lord go with us. Although this is a stiff-necked people, forgive our wickedness and our sin, and take us as your inheritance."

10 Then the LORD said: "I am making a covenant with you. Before all your people I will do wonders never before done in any nation in all the world. The people you live among will see how awesome is the work that I, the LORD, will do for you. 11 Obey what I command you today. I will drive out before you the Amorites, Canaanites, Hittites, Perizzites, Hivites and Jebusites. 12 Be careful not to make a treaty with those who live in the land where you are going, or they will be a snare among you. 13 Break down their altars, smash their sacred stones and cut down their Asherah poles. [a] 14 Do not worship any other god, for the LORD, whose name is Jealous, is a jealous God.

15 "Be careful not to make a treaty with those who live in the land; for when they prostitute themselves to their gods and sacrifice to them, they will invite you and you will eat their sacrifices. 16 And when you choose some of their daughters as wives for your sons and those daughters prostitute themselves to their gods, they will lead your sons to do the same.

17 "Do not make cast idols.

18 "Celebrate the Feast of Unleavened Bread. For seven days eat bread made without yeast, as I commanded you. Do this at the appointed time in the month of Abib, for in that month you came out of Egypt.

19 "The first offspring of every womb belongs to me, including all the firstborn males of your livestock, whether from herd or flock. 20 Redeem the firstborn donkey with a lamb, but if you do not redeem it, break its neck. Redeem all your firstborn sons.
"No one is to appear before me empty-handed.

21 "Six days you shall labor, but on the seventh day you shall rest; even during the plowing season and harvest you must rest.

22 "Celebrate the Feast of Weeks with the firstfruits of the wheat harvest, and the Feast of Ingathering at the turn of the year. 23 Three times a year all your men are to appear before the Sovereign LORD, the God of Israel. 24 I will drive out nations before you and enlarge your territory, and no one will covet your land when you go up three times each year to appear before the LORD your God.

25 "Do not offer the blood of a sacrifice to me along with anything containing yeast, and do not let any of the sacrifice from the Passover Feast remain until morning.

26 "Bring the best of the firstfruits of your soil to the house of the LORD your God.
"Do not cook a young goat in its mother's milk."
27 Then the LORD said to Moses, "Write down these words, for in accordance with these words I have made a covenant with you and with Israel." 28 Moses was there with the LORD forty days and forty nights without eating bread or drinking water. And he wrote on the tablets the words of the covenant—the Ten Commandments.


Basically what happened iz God gave Moses 10 commands for him to give the people. God Himself wrote them on the stone tablets. Then He said He would cut a covenant with Moses and the people and the subsequent (pink) where the terms of the covenant. So after He cut the covenant with Moses He told Moses to write that down.

What you need to study is the difference between a commandment and a covenant and in this specific instance God did both with them at the same time. Its tricky but not hard to see clearly if you just read it how it is written.
 

Caelum07

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ok back!
*runs in with bible, notes, and internet sources*
Ritual Decalogue vs Ethical Decalogue
The Ritual Decalogue is one of the two very different lists within the Torah that are known as the Decalogue or Ten Commandments — the name decalogue (δέκα λόγοι) merely means ten sayings. The Ritual Decalogue is the list of commandments in Exodus 34. As they concern points of ritual, rather than ethics, they are viewed as having minor significance compared to the Ethical Decalogue. Consequently, although the Ritual Decalogue appears in the text at the point where Moses inscribes the Ten Commandments into the two stone tablets, and it is they rather than the Ethical Decalogue which are identified as the Ten Commandments, it is the Ethical Decalogue which is commonly believed to have been inscribed on the tablets.
According to Orthodox Jewish tradition, though, there is no "Ritual Decalogue" as it relates to anything more significant than the rest of the bible. The verses that are purported to serve as a replacement or reorganization or rehashment of the standard Ten Commandments of Exodus 20 and Deuteronomy 5 are merely viewed as additional religious commandments. Compared to the Ethical Decalogue, the Ritual Decalogue is clearer as to where one commandment ends and the next begins; and as the Ritual Decalogue is less important in most modern faiths, it is less divisive to enumerate its commandments.

  • Either the commandments of the Ritual Decalogue were originally indistinct commandments in the body of a much larger work, such as the Covenant Code, and were selected as being the most important by some process, whether gradual filtering or by an individual,
  • Or the Covenant Code represents a later expansion of the Ritual Decalogue, with additional commandments added on, again either by gradual aggregation, or by an individual.
The documentary hypothesis identifies the Ritual Decalogue as the work of the Jahwist, from the Kingdom of Judah, and the Covenant Code as that of the Elohist, from the Kingdom of Israel, both writing independently. It does not however answer the question of how these texts were related, merely that the Ritual Decalogue circulated in Judah, and the Covenant Code in Israel. What the documentary hypothesis does partly explain is the relationship of the Ritual Decalogue to the Ethical Decalogue, and why, instead of the Ethical Decalogue, it is the Ritual Decalogue which is written on the two tablets when Moses ascends the mountain to have the Ethical Decalogue inscribed for a second time.
The documentary hypothesis claims that the Jahwist and Elohist texts were first combined by a redactor, producing a text referred to simply as JE, in such a way that it now read that God dictated the Covenant Code, which was written onto stone, Moses subsequently smashing these stones at the incident of the golden calf, and thus having to go back and get a new set, with a set of commandments, the Ritual Decalogue, resembling the first. Under this reconstruction another writer, the Priestly source, later took offence at parts of JE, and rewrote it, dropping the story of the golden calf, and replacing the Ritual Decalogue with a new (ethical) decalogue initially based on it, but taking commandments from elsewhere as well, and replacing the Covenant Code with a vast new law code, placed after the Decalogue for narrative reasons, most of which forms the greater part of the mitzvot in Leviticus.

*wishing I had continued hebrew lessons* but like I said in the other post. The bible was written by men, and because of such (ie argument above between the Priestly source and JE) there will some biases, mistakes, etc.

Which reminds me of a joke.
A catholic preist dies and when he gets to heaven he asks God why priests are to remain celibate. God looks at him and says "Celibate? Its supposed to say Celebrate!"
Ha ha
*runs out of thread ducking the rotten tomatoes being thrown*
 

Dyme Peaze

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Ok am I the only one who cracks up at moses slamming tablets that God himself wrote to smithereens ?

Every time I read that I giggle.
 

Dyme Peaze

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11 Obey what I command you today. I will drive out before you the Amorites, Canaanites, Hittites, Perizzites, Hivites and Jebusites. 12 Be careful not to make a treaty with those who live in the land where you are going, or they will be a snare among you. 13 Break down their altars, smash their sacred stones and cut down their Asherah poles. [a] 14 Do not worship any other god, for the LORD, whose name is Jealous, is a jealous God.


Good Post ProNet123Woboo

You brought something to my attention in the scripture I copied and pasted from yours.
So this cancells out the citing issue you seem to have.

Do you guys see what I have highlighted ?

I thought God SMOTE all but 8 people.

Where the hell did the caananites come from ?
Likewise with the Amorites come from ?
Jubusites as well ?
 

V Hexerei

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god was very specific with moses. he told him to chisel out two new tablets and he would recite the words that were on the FIRST tablets.

And the LORD said unto Moses, Hew thee two tables of stone like unto the first: and I will write upon these tables the words that were in the first tables, which thou brakest.

Hmm..so he tells him that he will give him the commandments again on these tablets. That does not sound like he wanted it to be something different. Moses did not even have a chance to read off the original commandments!! He broke them and they were replaced with these.

Not only that, but there are 17 rules, not ten!

..there is a "christian" here that does not know what he/she is talking about...again.
 

V Hexerei

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11 Obey what I command you today. I will drive out before you the Amorites, Canaanites, Hittites, Perizzites, Hivites and Jebusites. 12 Be careful not to make a treaty with those who live in the land where you are going, or they will be a snare among you. 13 Break down their altars, smash their sacred stones and cut down their Asherah poles. [a] 14 Do not worship any other god, for the LORD, whose name is Jealous, is a jealous God.


Good Post ProNet123Woboo

You brought something to my attention in the scripture I copied and pasted from yours.
So this cancells out the citing issue you seem to have.

Do you guys see what I have highlighted ?

I thought God SMOTE all but 8 people.

Where the hell did the caananites come from ?
Likewise with the Amorites come from ?
Jubusites as well ?

and he also tells them to tear down the Asherah poles. Funny, being that asherah was gods wife in earlier religions....Always hating on the woman.
 

Dyme Peaze

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and he also tells them to tear down the Asherah poles. Funny, being that asherah was gods wife in earlier religions....Always hating on the woman.

Well see this is a wife I didnt know anything about, Now I know that God has divorced at least twice.

*Going to research she who must not be named now*

icon14.gif
 

V Hexerei

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Well see this is a wife I didnt know anything about, Now I know that God has divorced at least twice.

*Going to research she who must not be named now*

icon14.gif

happy reading! You are going to find out all kinds of interesting things took place in the early hebrew days. They were something else...to say the least. lol
 
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